Author Topic: The ELECTION Thread  (Read 254385 times)

Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #250 on: July 28, 2010, 04:41:40 PM »
LOL, Wyzeguy, did it occur to you, why that was put in italics in the first place?  Go and read it again, it was a quoted from the link bnwt posted with a prefacing statement that went something like this: "One of the few objective comments on that 'sabotage' link was this:"

Here, nick on over to the site I quoted it from and ask the person who posted it if her opinion is Gospel.  I just happened to agree with her.  LOL.  Next?

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/politics/sabotage-and-there-may-be-more-to-come-20100727-10uc0.html?autostart=1

On the Second Point? What issues are you talking about here?  Abbots attempt to undermine the present Marine Reserve program by enlisting the fishing industry under false pretenses?  Or his refusal to tax his mining buddies and fund infrastructure?  


Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #251 on: July 28, 2010, 05:00:08 PM »
BTW, just so you are aware of just how unconscionably this 'informant' (if they actually exist), has acted, this is the whole concept of Cabinet confidentiality and the pledges taken to honour discretion and integrity.   So whoever has done this (if they exist) is clearly someone who can't be trusted, and that is self evident in their actions.   

The concept of Cabinet confidentiality 

Two key interlinked features of Cabinet are collective responsibility and confidentiality. Members of Cabinet are collectively responsible for the decisions made by Cabinet. While disagreement may be aired within the confines of a Cabinet meeting, it is a convention that cabinet decisions will be fully and publicly supported by all Ministers, despite any personal views held by individual Ministers. Ministers and any officials are expected to refrain from public comment on matters to be considered by Cabinet. The confidentiality of cabinet proceedings supports the principle of collective responsibility, by promoting open and free discussion including the airing of dissenting views and compromise. The Cabinet Handbook states:

    Ministry, Cabinet and Cabinet committees are forums in which ministers, while working towards a collective position, are able to discuss proposals and a variety of options and views with complete freedom. The openness and frankness of discussions in the Cabinet Room are protected by the strict observance of this confidentiality.

Fidelity to Cabinet is seen as critical to maintaining the position of a Minister of the Crown, as Quick and Garran remarked in 1901, ‘if any member of the Cabinet seriously dissents from the opinion and policy approved by the majority of his colleagues it is his duty as a man of honour to resign’. Ministers who participate in meetings of the Federal Executive Council, established by s. 62 of the Constitution, ‘shall take the oath of allegiance, the official oath and the oath of fidelity’.


So, this person has also breached their oath of allegiance under the constitution, their official oath and oath of fidelity, and that's OK?


 

wyzeguy60

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #252 on: July 28, 2010, 05:10:05 PM »
I have come to the distinct conclusion that there is absolutely no point arguing with you rebel.

It doesn't matter what is pointed out you twist it to your own advantage and escape from the point I was making. I find that highly offensive to say the least - reminds me of some inane union bosses I have had the displeasure of dealing with.

It is annoying and inflamatory to criticise a Liberal leader with no PROOF and in the same breath speak volumes about Labor's agenda - an agenda which is clearly designed to rack the country with obscene debt, waste millions on the education revolution, fail dismally in the delivery of insulation installation resulting in at least 4 deaths and 147 house fires and growing, fail on key election promises, etc etc.

That is the point I was making - NOT whether I copied a link in Italics from a previous post !!!!

need I say more.


Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #253 on: July 28, 2010, 05:22:47 PM »
I have come to the distinct conclusion that there is absolutely no point arguing with you rebel.

It doesn't matter what is pointed out you twist it to your own advantage and escape from the point I was making. I find that highly offensive to say the least - reminds me of some inane union bosses I have had the displeasure of dealing with


Firstly, you seem to be more argumentative in that regard, I'm simply addressing the issues, and where possible providing links to legislation or other aspects of the debate that dispel assumption.  I haven't twisted anything, here's how it went.  You quoted something that I hadn't actually said, and then specifically got agro at me, not the statement with challenging rhetoric such as:

oh is that so.

Have you got proof of the following statement or is your opinion gospel ???


Who were you addressing that to?  And in what way does that type of approach seem anything but hostile?, particularly given that I didn't make the comments you reacted to? 

As for ALP doing the same, it is the ALP who are administering the current Marine Reserve Program Federally, and Abbott who wishes to scrap it.  You figure it out.

Oh, and please, the Pink Bat Program again?  It was the many dishonest contracting firms who installed the wrong materials under UNSAFE work conditions that have caused the fires and the deaths and that's exactly what State Courts are finding as they charge and sue those really responsible.   All the Govt did was make a bloody rebate available.  Anyway, I guess for some it's easy to just believe whatever Abbott says,  and never look into the real story.  Being skeptical is healthy, you should try it, particularly with anything Abbott has to say. 


*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #254 on: July 28, 2010, 06:04:45 PM »
http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/newshome/7653559/abbott-promises-drastic-fisheries-overhal/

See he really does not care what West Australians think Polling last week in WA showed that 8-in-10 WA voters support high levels of marine protection and a recent independent economic study showed that marine sanctuaries would help boost our southwest tourism industries to $55 million per year," he said.

people  need to read the whole story in context .... this is an important sentence
Mr Abbott also promised that under a Coalition government all future decisions on marine protected areas would be considered using peer reviewed scientific evidence that would be made available to all stakeholders, including local communities and fishing industries

This means he does care what the public think

wyzeguy60

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #255 on: July 28, 2010, 06:06:11 PM »
okay back to school time

who said these words on this forum

1 - i.e. Not trying to argue the actual marine preservation status itself, or giving support to Abbott to barstardise the current scheme.

2 - Why not suggest that to the Fishing organisations instead of just throwing preferences to Abbott so he can open the door to his mining mates under false pretenses?

3 - Assisting Abbott to overturn the entire Marine reserve classification scheme thinking it will make any difference to recreational fishing (and thereby advantaging only the mining interests) is a travesty.

Have you got proof ( yes PROOF ) of his intentions in this regard ?

Provide the proof and I will back off.

Please don't think I am hostile at all but when somebody keeps pressing their agenda against Abbott then there comes a point where his believers and followers may react.

It probably surprises you to hear this. I would rather eat sewerage than entertain a vote for that annoying striny red head.

 ;D

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #256 on: July 28, 2010, 06:18:57 PM »
I would rather eat sewerage than entertain a vote for that annoying striny red head.

move to Queensland ...Toowoomba in particular and Anna Bligh will have you drinking it if she and the TCC have their way , despite 67% voting no for treating waste water into drinking water they know better

Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #257 on: July 28, 2010, 06:21:11 PM »
Abbott himself is saying it.  The very fact that the regions that are on the table right now for Marine Park status, are also two locations  where mining companies want access for unsustainable mining at any cost, tells me already that his penchant to disrupt marine reserves has nothing to do with fishing.  

Fishy yes, fishing no.  The very fact that he also 'WON'T' tax the mining companies when our National Infrastructure is crippling to breaking point, is also a fairly good indication of where his loyalties lie.  

The fact that the guy can't even articulate an intelligent reply in a press conference without Hockey and another of the club there to hold his hand, and even then with three of them, still they couldn't do more than play the blame game?  Tells me he can't handle the top job.

Did you actually Watch Julia Gillard answer questions this morning?  Intelligent open, and unscripted on every point.  She didn't need to consult anyone standing beside her.  Abbott by comparison was floundering, and couldn't string a sentence together that didn't include his negative sloganism or his entourage jumping in to save him?  

As for judging someone on how they look?  How shallow is that?  I couldn't care less what Abbott Looks like, his complete lack of intelligence and ability to string two intelligent sentences together is what puts me off him.  Oh and the contradictions.  That too.

Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #258 on: July 28, 2010, 06:33:44 PM »
Mr Abbott also promised that under a Coalition government all future decisions on marine protected areas would be considered using peer reviewed scientific evidence that would be made available to all stakeholders, including local communities and fishing industries

That seems to suggest that he won't be consulting them, just making his 'peer' reviewed scientific evidence available to stakeholders.  He's not saying he'll include their interests or stakeholders themselves in the decision making process.  So here's a wild card.  Who will make up this so called Peer Reviewed Scientific Panel?  People of his Govts choosing?

mandurahmum

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 2560
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #259 on: July 28, 2010, 06:57:22 PM »
Why aren't we hearing about the 2 wars we are fighting - are they no longer election issues?  Especially now that all those papers have been leaked.  Is it just a given that we will stay for as long as it takes - even though it seems that both are unwinnable wars.

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #260 on: July 28, 2010, 06:59:25 PM »
I have no idea , but do you know what the current process is ?????

I dont know that either , but I have read that the Dept of Environment , water , heritage and the arts dont even ask the dept of fisheries for any input before they want to make an area a Marine reserve ...

I am not saying that there shouldnt be marine reserves I just dont think they need to declare somewhere like Margaret River a marine reserve just so it stops the mining coz it also stops a lot of other activities as well ...... they should just use common sense and if they dont want an oil rig there just say you aint putting an oil rig there .... simple as that .......no need to got to any other lengths

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #261 on: July 28, 2010, 07:21:51 PM »
http://www.oceanplanet.org.au/national.php#wa

Whilst searching for info on the current process I have just found this site , and it seems to contradict things mentioned in other links and stories mentioned by us on this thread in relation to this , for example ....

Western Australia has thirteen multiple use marine parks, marine management areas and marine nature reserves, covering 11.7% of the state waters, with a high level of protection offered to 2.4% of the state waters
one of the other sites or stories said 1%

also this ....
As part of that process, the government is taking advice from ‘stakeholders’ or people connected to the ocean for any reason (be it recreational or commercial), for their view on marine management. It is utterly crucial for everyone who has an interest in the future health of our oceans to have their say in this process
which is precisely what Abbott was suggesting and has been poo pooed for ??


wyzeguy60

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #262 on: July 28, 2010, 07:22:22 PM »
Abbott himself is saying it.  The very fact that the regions that are on the table right now for Marine Park status, are also two locations  where mining companies want access for unsustainable mining at any cost, tells me already that his penchant to disrupt marine reserves has nothing to do with fishing.

no argument from me if that is in fact what he ends up doing

Fishy yes, fishing no.  The very fact that he also 'WON'T' tax the mining companies when our National Infrastructure is crippling to breaking point, is also a fairly good indication of where his loyalties lie.

I don't in any way support the mining tax. I'll add the following extract from my letter to my local member on the issue.
" What I cannot understand is peoples desire to penalise our large mining companies. They pay royalties to their respective state governments, they pay company and payroll tax. They provide an enormous contribution to communities in terms of labour hire, amenities and community funds. They provide the equipment, buildings and expertise. They provide substantial export dollars which helps to balance imports. They provide infrastructure which in turn helps remote communities.
Lets just add another massive tax to this and the effect will be astronomical. Companies will invest far less and will down size or at worst cease to exist. Current and future exploration and investment may also cease. Jobs will be lost and exports will diminish. State revenue will fall and so will the states spending power. Unemployment will be a huge issue in effected areas and so will the drain on welfare. Money markets will tumble and so will your hard earned super. Commonwealth revenue will also fall from these sectors adding to an already obscene debt. In effect the resource tax will wipe out any benefit it creates in a very short time. The burden will then fall on you – the public – and other companies as new tax measures are bought in to cope with the shortfall. And all states and territories will suffer – not just the few who rely heavily on resources. If there is less revenue overall and a greater debt commonwealth funding to states will be reduced. This effects Hospitals, schools and other services as these cut backs are made. "

The fact that the guy can't even articulate an intelligent reply in a press conference without Hockey and another of the club there to hold his hand, and even then with three of them, still they couldn't do more than play the blame game?  Tells me he can't handle the top job.

No single individual knows everything about all aspects of Government - fact.

Did you actually Watch Julia Gillard answer questions this morning?  Intelligent open, and unscripted on every point.  She didn't need to consult anyone standing beside her.  Abbott by comparison was floundering, and couldn't string a sentence together that didn't include his negative sloganism or his entourage jumping in to save him?

No - can't stand her voice

As for judging someone on how they look?  How shallow is that?  I couldn't care less what Abbott Looks like, his complete lack of intelligence and ability to string two intelligent sentences together is what puts me off him.  Oh and the contradictions.  That too.

nobody said anything about her looks - not bad for a middle ager. see point above about voice.

 ;D

MrsFluffyDodgers

  • Knight
  • ***
  • Posts: 178
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #263 on: July 28, 2010, 07:29:09 PM »
I would think it would be against the rules of Parliament to bring children in there.  Whatever would posses a woman to take her baby to work – and parliament at that – and set about publicly nurturing her child?  It was not the result of being forced into the position of feeding because there was nowhere else, like I occasionally found myself in.  It was a forced and contrived situation – unnatural.  In my humble and considered opinion, it would have been to make a point and an unnecessary one in those circumstances at that.  
As I recall, she had to attend an important vote in the house. The bells were rung necessitating her being there. I remember that there was a large deal of criticism pointed at her - regarding the care of her daughter. (She did have a carer - but this person could not provide feeding.)



'The Times They are a Changin' and I think that's a good thing.  No woman should be humiliated or ejected for breast feeding.  I'd stand up for any nursing mum being harassed over it.  Who wouldn't?

Various women I personally know, have returned to work shortly after having their child, in 'salaried professional positions', and on various occasions had to breast feed on the run.  (Modesty taken into account of course)   That's life.  

Good Evening Mr Loco.  It is likewise always wonderful to see you as well!  

Greetings Miss Rebel.  

Yes it is certainly not acceptable for any woman to be humiliated for breastfeeding.  …….  But that was not my actual point and not a situation that I found when I was feeding little Fluffy.   It is good and appropriate for other people (and ducks lol) to be considerate of a nursing mother.  But it is also appropriate for a woman (or duck) to consider others and how they may feel given the situation.  Give and take.   It should work both ways.  

And perhaps in the case of the woman sitting in parliament at that particular time she may have had no choice… or maybe she did.  But I do wonder why ever was she was trying to hold down a job like that at that time of her life – in parliament of all things - when she had chosen to have a child and had responsibilities to her child and would have known it was very possible she could be put in that situation.  They do have maternity leave to accommodate mothers, much of it paid.   The baby must have been very young to need an unexpected feed.  The other alternative would be to get the child minded and fed with expressed or substitute milk.  Still not the best for the child, but would have left the mother free to act as she wanted to without impacting others and potentialy the whole country in this case.

I can understand people taking their children into a workplace in the school holidays as long as they look after them and don’t put pressure in any way on their workmates.  I never did it, and would take leave or pay for minding, but I do understand it.)  

There is no place IMO whatever at any time in the work place for a baby (or duckling lol).  A baby needs total, continual and absolute care and a mother would know that before she took the baby in.

It’s called trying to have your cake and eat it too… and making other people responsible for your decisions, situation and actions.  We live in a selfish, self centred and demanding pond society.  
Any cream cakes or chocolate?

HellWest'nCrooked

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 4778
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #264 on: July 28, 2010, 07:49:32 PM »



  Good evening Mrs Dodgers.........my oh my you have a way with words....
  couldn't have put it better myself......... and I do like the part about  "mindful of others"


   Westie  :ivanhoe:
Ain't no rhyme or reason
No complicated meaning

mandurahmum

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 2560
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #265 on: July 28, 2010, 08:07:38 PM »
The senator that was asked to take her child out of federal parliament was not breastfeeding - she just wanted to spend time with her 2 year child before it left for adelaide with her husband.  I know I have confused her with Kristy Marshall that was breastfeeding.

There was no reason for this child to be in chambers - although a lot of childish behaviour goes on there - it is no place for a child.

And Fluffee - I agree with everything you have said.  I breastfeed my son - and sometimes in public - but I dont think anyone ever noticed - because I was discrete.  I dont think any breastfeeding mother should ever be hassled about breast feeding in public.

Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #266 on: July 28, 2010, 08:19:52 PM »
I am not saying that there shouldnt be marine reserves I just dont think they need to declare somewhere like Margaret River a marine reserve just so it stops the mining coz it also stops a lot of other activities as well ...... they should just use common sense and if they dont want an oil rig there just say you aint putting an oil rig there .... simple as that .......no need to got to any other lengths

I completely agree and that's what I said earlier about the recreational fishing enthusiasts distancing themselves from commercial fishing and challenging the State Govts over their specific restrictions.  The Fed Govt has NOTHING to do with those fishery and waterways laws and in NSW they are now all under one department that everyone mutually hates.  LOL.  At least it's all in one place.

Unfortunately however, there are no specific laws that protect an area from mining in particular as far as I know, other than the Umbrella Marine Reserve Status Federally. That's the problem, it needs to be more specific, but it STILL won't change any of the recreational fishing regulations set down by State Govt Authorities if it isn't applied under Abbott.    It will however, enable Mining companies to exploit it if Tony scraps the current program, and that's just not on.   

In addition to that, and as Mum said, the local Govt have a vested interest in getting the balance right and they know the region.  So it should be up to them to manage the water ways not the Federal Govt.  But unless they have the laws to protect Margaret River 'in State', then it's over to the Feds to step in.

I'll see if I can find anything on whether they can stop mining without declaring a marine reserve.   Maybe the State Govt itself has a mechanism to do this, and would therefore be in control of it.  Then a Federal Reserve wouldn't be needed.   

Wyzeguy, as for the poor mining companies, forgive me for playing the worlds tiniest violin in their honour.  They're paying us $1.00 in $7.00 whereas they used to pay $1.00 in $3.00.  How is it that their share gets bigger and our share gets smaller?  They've had a free ride long enough.  Time to pay the piper.

mandurahmum

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 2560
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #267 on: July 28, 2010, 08:30:29 PM »
http://www.oceanplanet.org.au/national.php#wa

Whilst searching for info on the current process I have just found this site , and it seems to contradict things mentioned in other links and stories mentioned by us on this thread in relation to this , for example ....

Western Australia has thirteen multiple use marine parks, marine management areas and marine nature reserves, covering 11.7% of the state waters, with a high level of protection offered to 2.4% of the state waters
one of the other sites or stories said 1%

also this ....
As part of that process, the government is taking advice from ‘stakeholders’ or people connected to the ocean for any reason (be it recreational or commercial), for their view on marine management. It is utterly crucial for everyone who has an interest in the future health of our oceans to have their say in this process
which is precisely what Abbott was suggesting and has been poo pooed for ??



I find this website questionable.  If you click on the link to WA"S marine reserves - it takes you to the marine reserves for SA.

It does however say that you can fish in these areas too.

Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #268 on: July 28, 2010, 08:42:52 PM »
Western Australia has thirteen multiple use marine parks, marine management areas and marine nature reserves, covering 11.7% of the state waters, with a high level of protection offered to 2.4% of the state waters
one of the other sites or stories said 1%


There are State and Federal classifications the 1% is Federal Marine Reserves.  The other reserves are State declared and Administered:

Marine reserves extend to the WA State Waters boundary, generally 3 nautical miles offshore, but further where offshore islands exist. These marine reserves are covered by WA legislation.

Generally, the marine reserves are established under the WA Conservation and Land Management Act (CALM). Any restrictions to fishing within the marine reserve are specified under the WA Fish Resources Management Act (FRMA).

Other marine reserves may be in Commonwealth Waters which commence at the limit of State Waters and extend out to 200 nautical miles. These marine reserves are covered by Commonwealth legislation, generally the Commonwealth Environment Protection and Biodiversity Conservation Act 1999 (EPBC). Fishing restrictions are specified within the Management Plan for each marine reserve.


http://www.recfishwest.org.au/MarineParks.htm

BTW, the link above has a wealth of info on WA recreational fishing.  



Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #269 on: July 28, 2010, 08:45:29 PM »
I doubt therefore that a Fed Marine reserve in Commonwealth Waters that far out is going to have much impact on recreational fishing, unless you are fishing more than 3kms offshore.  How many do that? 

*Yibida*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 17998
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #270 on: July 28, 2010, 10:20:40 PM »


This is the mob: http://www.vnpa.org.au/  Victorian National Parks Association

Despite the organization name they are in NO WAY connected to a government body of any kind..... It's an underhanded name to give the impression they are !... All very official looking { smoke and mirrors } no wonder the Polly's were peanut washed... all the reports from the marine investigation company they commissioned have been worded to there benefit... try getting the original reports that were handed to them ! good luck ! many from the fishing community have tried....

ask Geoff Wilson for the low down, he is a fantastic bloke who champions for the Victorian angler ... Geoff Wilson has successfully tackled many aspects of fishing, including land-based game fishing, of which he was one of the pioneers to fishing the rivers, inlets, bays and beaches of the western coastal regions of Victoria

Geoff is also the fishing writer for the Geelong Advertiser and is a regular contributor to a number of Fishing magazines and fishing related web sites, he has written many fine books which have proven to be very popular reading with thousands of anglers all over Australia. Of particular note is Geoff's excellent artistic flair for fishing illustrations featured in many magazines...

Geoff has been at logger heads on this issue from the start....as I have and many others working to get the truth out there...

mandurahmum

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 2560
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #271 on: July 28, 2010, 10:57:28 PM »
Yibs - that site does look deceptively like its a government organisation. 

I dont have much to do with fisheries wa over here - I only see them when they do their safety checks - which they seem to do every weekend.  They are fantastic - they just make sure you have all the safety equip and that you know the bag limits.  They also give out the rulers and guide to the fish and crabs.  They are also waiting at the dock when you have finished - just to make sure that you have not gone over the bag limit.  I have never seen them give out a fine so I assume most of us obey the rules.  You do see them in the Offshore fishing club a lot though - talking to the fishing community, and lying about the size of the fish they caught too.






*Yibida*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 17998
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #272 on: July 28, 2010, 11:03:09 PM »


Yes mandurahmum... very deceptive in name and how they go about things....

Our Victorian Fisheries department have no affiliation with VNPA what so ever... No government body is connected with them either...

*wheels*

  • Knights of the RT
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 8000
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #273 on: July 28, 2010, 11:33:27 PM »
Evening all.

An election? Doesn't matter who you vote for you'll be electing a politician and no good will ever come of that.

I have nothing useful or relevant to add but I do have one question.

Yibs, is there really a Victorian parliamentarian named Joe Helper??

*Yibida*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 17998
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #274 on: July 28, 2010, 11:48:10 PM »
Evening all.

An election? Doesn't matter who you vote for you'll be electing a politician and no good will ever come of that.

I have nothing useful or relevant to add but I do have one question.

Yibs, is there really a Victorian parliamentarian named Joe Helper??


Hi Wheelsie yes there is a Mr Helper.....

Damian Thompson | Departmental Liaison Officer
Office of Joe Helper MP
Minister for Agriculture
Minister for Small Business
t +61 (0) 3 9658 4146    f +61 (0) 3 9658 4671  e damian.thompson@minstaff.vic.gov.au
§ Please consider the environment before printing this e-mail.

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #275 on: July 28, 2010, 11:53:08 PM »
he has a dwarf son called Santas little

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #276 on: July 29, 2010, 08:44:04 AM »
Since the Debate leaders now equal on Job Approval – Gillard (46%) cf. Abbott (46%)
The gender gap is closing for Tony Abbott



http://www.roymorgan.com/news/polls/2010/4544/

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #277 on: July 29, 2010, 09:17:46 AM »
look at these poll results from the SMH ....questions aswered by a lot more people than Morgan ...
this is what I was saying a couple of weeks ago , using survey/poll results on such a small percentage of people is useless .... look at the vast difference in these polls and neither would actually probably be anywhere near acurate over the entire population ...but look at the prefered PM nearly 30,000 respondants

Do you think Julia Gillard is sincere?
Yes 15.12% (1490 votes)
No 84.88% (8366 votes)
Total votes: 9856

If the Federal Election was held today, which party would receive your first preference in the House of Representatives?
Labor 22.7% (977 votes)
Liberal 64.53% (2776 votes)
National 2.14% (92 votes)
Greens 5.79% (249 votes)
Independent or other 2.12% (91 votes)
None of them 2.72% (117 votes)
Total votes: 4302

Who would you rather have as PM?
Julia Gillard 21.58% (6285 votes)
Tony Abbott 78.42% (22845 votes)
Total votes: 29130

Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #278 on: July 29, 2010, 12:06:20 PM »
I wrote to Bob Brown last night and I'm reasonably sure he'll reply as I am on the Green mailing list.  (not because I'm a green voter, but because I like to keep up to date on environmental debates).   I'm also writing to the ALP today, to point out that their policies are not that much better than the opposition on Mining specifically, and ask why this particular issue isn't being mentioned in the lead up to the election by either party.  

I'm not arguing against mining, I'm enquiring as to why 'sustainable mining' and 'fair remuneration' isn't on the table so Australia itself can vote on this issue.  Particularly given the ALP's 'open door' policy on mining vs Tony Abbotts 'no tax on mining' over his dead political body approach.  The outcome of course is that Australia is being literally raped for her mineral resources, while being paid less than half as much in remuneration as 15 years ago?  How is that?  Who's really benefiting ?   Gee I wonder how we fund infrastructure upgrade?  doh !!!

If it comes to a question of who is benefiting the most by mining in Australia, its the mining companies, not everyday Australians footing the bill for a crippled infrastructure.  Then consider that it's OUR resources they are profiting by for a mere 'bag of beads', and it becomes obvious whose interests are at the forefront, for both major parties.

i.e. BOTH parties intend to give the Mining industry concessions but one party wants to remove all level of protection, and allow mining companies to keep getting away with short sheeting the Australian people in terms of remuneration.  

Let me reiterate for Wyzeguy, I'm referring these remarks and criticisms of both major parties 'On the Mining Issue' in particular.  Not on Political philosophies.  

If these mining companies are going to profit by many BILLIONS of dollars on the back of OUR resources, whilst our infrastructure is crippling after years of underfunding and short sheeting, then they should jollywell be made to pay a fair remuneration for it.

The Libs will give them even more concessions but no price rise?.  After all it was under the last Coalition (User Pay) govt. that the price dropped from $1.00 in $3.00 to $1.00 in $7.00.  So their 'User Pay' philosophy applies to us, but not the mining companies?  

At least the ALP has tried to make the mining companies pay their fair share and just look what happened?  (not that the ALP are innocent in all this, they're not, as I'll demonstrate below)

When the mining companies were challenged over more remuneration for our resources, They declared media war and undermined an elected PM  !!!  In effect they declared war on the interests of the Australian people.  Who else is that bloody powerful in this country?  Any country for that matter?

So, just to demonstrate I am as critical of ALP on their free for all access policy on mining specifically, as I am on Abbott's 'key to the coffers' approach, this article sets out the debate over Mineral resources vs Marine Sanctuaries currently.  You be the judge of whose interests are at the forefront.   The Australian People and our Infrastructure and Environment? or the Powerful Mining Industry ?

Oil lease threatens WA icon:
CORTLAN BENNETT
May 17, 2010
http://news.smh.com.au/breaking-news-national/oil-lease-threatens-wa-icon-greenies-20100517-v8x9.html

The waters off the coast are home to unique marine life and half the world's whale and dolphin species, the WA Conservation Council says.The rugged coastal region is under consideration by the federal Environment Department as a marine sanctuary.

But at the Australian Petroleum Production and Exploration Association (APPEA) conference in Brisbane on Monday, federal Resources Minister Martin Ferguson announced 31 new oil and gas exploration leases around the country, including two less than 90km off the Margaret River coast.

According to Nicol (WA Conservation Council) "The minister has jumped the gun on critical protection of the marine environment and his actions are in stark contrast to those of (US) President Barack Obama, who froze all new oil and gas approvals off the US within days of the Gulf spill."

Mr Nicol said that over the past 18 months, 76 oil and gas approvals had been made in Australian waters while no marine reserves had been declared.


Almost 20 per cent of WA's marine environment was already tied up in oil and gas leases, while less than one per cent was protected, he said.

World Wildlife Fund WA director Paul Gamblin said it beggared belief the federal government was opening new oil and gas leases while the Montara oil spill was still being investigated."We still don't know exactly what went wrong," Mr Gamblin said.

"To release all this new acreage post-Montara, and while there's still a massive oil spill happening in the Gulf of Mexico, is premature."Until you know otherwise, you have to assume that could happen anywhere."


A spokesman for Mr Ferguson said the Margaret River coastal area would still be evaluated as a marine reserve by the federal Environment Department but within the framework of existing oil and gas leases.

He said there was no conflict between the two.


So, while Ferguson throws open access to the powerful mining lobby, (which the Libs are thrilled about no doubt), Abbott goes one better.  He'll scrap any new mining tax, and the Australian people will only receive more than $1.00 in $7.00 over his dead political body apparently.

Which wrong is more right?

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #279 on: July 29, 2010, 12:14:55 PM »
smee

I have always noticed that any poll results in the SMH tend to be tilted to the left

if that is the case I'd hate to be julia

interestingly if you look at all the polls that are running in the various media sites they say much the same

but the poll results that really count are the ones in marginal seats and if the Penrith by election was any indication ... I'd hate to be julia

I am feeling more and more confident that the result on August 21 is going to be even more enjoyable then that of the 1996 election




Rebel*1*

  • Guest
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #280 on: July 29, 2010, 12:27:05 PM »
LOL, I wouldn't get too cocky.   A few thousand in a poll is not representative of many millions of voters.  John Howard learned that in 2007, when we were 'never better off'.   Famous last words?

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #281 on: July 29, 2010, 12:46:01 PM »

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #282 on: July 29, 2010, 01:49:10 PM »
Gillard warns leakers: I'll sack you


lololololololollololololollolololololololololololol

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/gillard-warns-leakers-ill-sack-you/story-fn59niix-1225898443420

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #283 on: July 29, 2010, 02:34:38 PM »
some local colour

today when I went to my small local shop / post office there was much talk and praise for Beryl Gillard who happens to live just a few streets from me

her photo was in the Daily Telegraph with a story about julia gillard and the rise in the pension

it appears Beryl has become somewhat of a local celebrity with the following quote

Beryl Gillard, 83, from Pretty Beach on the Central Coast gets a part aged pension of $250 a week and a small "stipend" from her late husband's superannuation.

She was angry the PM was against increasing the aged pension by $30.

"She's a liar and a communist and we don't want communists in power," she said.

*Yibida*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 17998
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #284 on: July 29, 2010, 04:37:10 PM »


I'm frustrated we don't have more choice in leadership, policy's and party's... It's like being given two short straws in a hand and asked to pick one...........  short straw you loose..

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #285 on: July 29, 2010, 04:41:30 PM »
perhaps we should launch the Amigo party


I see that Belinda Neal has decided not to stand for Robertson as an independant since the Labor party found a more suitable candidate ......what a piece of work this woman is .... I reckon if you knocked on her door she would bark at you ....

*Yibida*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 17998
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #286 on: July 29, 2010, 04:47:06 PM »
perhaps we should launch the Amigo party


Oh sure smee... the most corrupted twisted self serving kinky abusive lawless rude threesome ever assembled.... and thats the quality's of just one Amigo....

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #287 on: July 29, 2010, 04:51:31 PM »
perhaps we should launch the Amigo party


Oh sure smee... the most corrupted twisted self serving kinky abusive lawless rude threesome ever assembled.... and thats the quality's of just one Amigo....

yeah guess you are right ....over qualified for the job

*Yibida*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 17998
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #288 on: July 29, 2010, 04:56:01 PM »
perhaps we should launch the Amigo party


Oh sure smee... the most corrupted twisted self serving kinky abusive lawless rude threesome ever assembled.... and thats the quality's of just one Amigo....

yeah guess you are right ....over qualified for the job


Oh I forgot..... Depraved also....

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #289 on: July 29, 2010, 06:00:15 PM »
smee

a friend of mine happens to live next door to Belinda 'don't you know who I am' Neal

it has been claimed that the household is not the quietest in the street

*smee*

  • Action Group
  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 46860
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #290 on: July 29, 2010, 06:01:48 PM »
what .... lots of barking ?


bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671

*r3830*

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3379
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #292 on: July 29, 2010, 07:56:01 PM »

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #293 on: July 30, 2010, 09:27:41 AM »

*r3830*

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3379
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #294 on: July 30, 2010, 09:38:55 AM »
Geeeez bnwt,

While I wouldn't have voted for Mr Rudd anyway, (personally don't believe in ETS - or Internet gagging) I was absolutely disgusted with the way he was 'shat upon', by those people who were supposed to be his undeniable supporters just the day before. That just about did it for me as far as supporting Labor was concerned. I'm still convinced that Mr Rudd would have won the forthcoming election in his own right. Why would he want to assist these crooks now!

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #295 on: July 30, 2010, 10:01:48 AM »
loco


it just goes to show that a drowning man will grab at anything

one the main reason I want to see Labor loss is to see the back room faceless men go down in flames

I wished I had have video taped it at the time when at the last election during the nights coverage after it was clear that rudd had won, they were speaking to one of his back room spin masters and he said something like, "this is the beginning of a 10 year reign for rudd as PM"

I said to myself, "you are going to eat those words"

*r3830*

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3379
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #296 on: July 30, 2010, 11:55:45 AM »
one the main reason I want to see Labor loss is to see the back room faceless men go down in flames

And aint that the truth!!!!!

*r3830*

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3379
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #297 on: July 30, 2010, 01:01:32 PM »
What Does This Election Mean for the Homeless - or The Elderly?

I was inspired this morning - and bounced the following message off to our local Liberal member. I'll post her response.... if forthcoming.


While walking through Penrith this morning, I met a frail, elderly lady who asked me if I could spare a dollar. Perhaps I'm out of touch - but I haven't seen this happening in the Penrith area before. She was obviously quite uncomfortable in asking.. but she invokes the following thoughts..
MANY of the people out here are seriously finding life difficult. Perhaps she was one of the people who doesn't have a home - or can't afford her bills - or can't afford to eat.... or buy clothes... or pay for prescriptions. After the recent election in Penrith, there was much talk how the result was due to the boat people, an important issue, no doubt. But, what about OUR people - who live - or dare I suggest, survive here - day by day? Do these people matter in the scheme of things - or is it too large an embarrassment for anyone to consider? Am I able to ask you - what is the Liberal position regarding our elderly people? What do they have to look forward to?

The big picture is a wonderful thing - but, occasionally, it's important to step back into the box in order to see things closer at hand that are easily overlooked.

And - YES - she did find a couple of dollars... and not just from me I might add!

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #298 on: July 30, 2010, 01:06:34 PM »

bnwt

  • Knight of the RT
  • *****
  • Posts: 3671
Re: The ELECTION Thread
« Reply #299 on: July 30, 2010, 01:31:29 PM »
an oldie but still relevant


http://youtu.be/wf3KovsW1Zo